Beer Wars Follow Up Thread

[Shawn, the Beer Philosopher]

Post your post Beer Wars thoughts here. Did you enjoy the film? Learn anything?

How about the live segments ... good? No good?

[Scott E. Kingsbury]

Just got home from the live and in-person UCLA version. Loved the movie...loved Anat...and the panel. The staging for the panel discussion was first-rate. Royce Hall was pretty packed. I just couldn't make myself go to the after-party at Blue Palms in Hollywood...I was so sick of traffic by the time I left Westwood....all I wanted was to hit the Bev-Mo and get home....

Now - - I'm about to "RUIN" a good evening, thanks be to "STONE"....(if you get my drift)

Pouring now....

G'night, Beer Warriors!

[Damien Lawrie]

I went to the film here in podunk West Texas, along with a grand total of about 12 beer lovers - not quite a sell out crowd.

My impressions were mixed. The awkward cue card reading before the film was aired did not set a great opening tone. Sort of a, take your seat and get ready for the best amateur documentary of your life.

Thankfully, the film itself lifted significantly. Plenty of good information, particularly for the non-beer geeks. I found the discussion on lobbying, the three-tier system and distribution channels to be pretty informative, fleshing out my knowledge a little more.

I thought the documentary did a great job of bringing out the personalities of some of the great characters in America's craft brewing world. Still, I'm not sure yet what to think of the inclusion of Rhonda... and especially the rather ill-conceived challenge to Moon Shot in the discussion session.

The discussion session promised much, but the format left a lot to be desired in my opinion. To have that number of participants on stage with only 30 minutes to talk was not such a great plan. Either extending the time significantly, or dropping some of the guests would have produced some actual discussion. And the choice of Ben Stein was probably a mistake :\

Overall, definitely worth watching, and a great conversation starter, but not without its defects.

[Chipper Dave]

Agree, the 3-tier system only helps the big guys. Probably why they spend millions lobbying to protect the 3-tier system. It's gotta go. At least the breweries here in Colorado can sell product to customers at their breweries. Maybe that's why we have so many.

[Bob Mack]

For full disclosure's sake, I'm a craft beer distributor. But in my opinion opponents of the three tiered system are missing three major points -

1) The current growth of the craft sector is happening within the three tiered system. The big guys haven't grown appreciably in the last 10 years in the same system. Doesn't seem like such a terrible deal to me. There are distributors who embrace the craft category and those who don't, but they all make a living selling what the consumer will buy. If it's craft beer that the consumer wants, the distributors will figure that out. As a side note - a big problem for many craft distributors is actually getting enough beer to sell - back to Sam's point in the film that he gets more orders from distributors than he actually has beer to sell them.

2) Many states allow for self distribution by breweries, but very few breweries choose to self distribute even in Colorado and California, the states cited in the film. The simple reason is economics - it costs more for breweries much bigger than a brewpub to self distribute than it does for them to partner with distributors. Look at it this way - if every brewery self distributes then you have a truck for each brewery making deliveries instead of a single truck making deliveries for many breweries so the price to the consumer goes up and beer sales slow down. Distribution is more cost effective and exists in almost every retail business outside of beer as well.

3) If there was no three tiered system Bud, Miller and Coors would have direct control of beer distribution instead of just having a lot of influence. Back to Sam's point in the panel discussion - Dogfish Head and Stone are in the top 50 breweries by size in the US, yet they are less than 1/50th the size of those breweries. The big guys would dominate to an even greater degree than they do today. A lot of markets in Europe or overseas where there is no three tiered system have mega brewery dominance greater than it is here, with less selection than we have in the US.

[Shawn, the Beer Philosopher]

Good points, Bob. Isn't it interesting that there's always "the other side of the story." While the three-tier system may have its significant flaws (and I believe it does), it still keeps the giants from completely stomping the little guys into extinction - albeit while maintaining their market dominance.

[gisbrewmaster]

I enjoyed the movie and learned some things. It sucks that the 3-tiered system ends up hurting the little guy.

[Scott E. Kingsbury]

Re-post from another site....my more in-depth "review"...

Perhaps the live venue was better. I was at the live event UCLA, and - although I wouldn't call the atmosphere "electric" - it was ripe with anticipation. Royce Hall was pretty-well packed (yeah, there were ushers directing people to sin in the middle "reserved" section, which was roped-off at first) and there seemed to be good and spontaneous reaction to the film. Sometimes seeing a movie is a packed theater is better than seeing a matinee at the local cineplex on a Tuesday afternoon. I found that to be the case with the live version of "Beer Wars". It was an "event".

As for the movie...I'm a beer geek, sometime home-brewer, I'm fifty-plus years old and I know what I like (I'm a fan of Stone and Dogfish both...and seeing Sam and Greg, two of my heroes, on the "big screen" was cool!) - - but I have to admit that I was painfully ignorant of the power of the Washington D.C. beer-lobby and the "three-tiered" distribution system as well. The film was educational for me...and I imagine that it was for many other people as well.

Was it the "Ben Hur" of beer movies? "Citizen Kane"?? Hardly. But I think that it was well-done, well-edited, had good pace from beginning to end... and I was never bored. I laughed, I got a lump in my throat during the scene when Ronda left her kids for yet another marketing trip...(I'm an old softy!)

The staging for the live panel was well-done - I'm not sure how it came off on a movie-screen...

Now...to be honest, I found the panel discussion to be just a yawning re-hash of the movie I had just seen. No new info was given...I am a Ben Stein fan (usually...I was actually on his show "Win Ben Stein's Money" back in the day...) - but his lame questions and lack of passion was....well...a downer. "Bueller....Bueller....??" Perhaps he was not a good choice after all. Personally, I would have liked to hear more from Todd Alström - what those of you could *not* see (those who were not there in the live venue) was the off-camera director giving Ben Stein the "hurry-up, move-it-along" sign as the panel was wrapping up...and Todd was not given the opportunity to defend his statement that Ronda's "Moonshot 69" was "&!$$."

All-in-all - I was glad I went. Let the discussion begin!

Fr. K.

[BahHumBrew]

The "live" showing in west coast theaters was 3 hr tape delayed. Since the live portion didn't really have any audience interaction, it could just a well been done at a pre-screen and would have benefited from some editing. I thought it was a poor compromise between informational and confrontational. Was there any chance for the audience to submit questions? Stating that the questions were from twitter was interesting but did they actually come from people that had just viewed the movie?

[BahHumBrew]

While the movie does make an interesting presentation of beer marketing issues, it is not at all about the craft brew industry itself. The movie’s concentration on a couple successful brewers and one struggling marketer misses the majority of the craft brew community. The hundreds of small breweries and brewpubs trying to compete in a local market are not represented. But I guess that was never the intent of the movie. I expect that future showings of the movie will be very limited. Perhaps it will find a home at universities offering brewer or business/marketing curriculum. I’m not getting the DVD.

[Shawn, the Beer Philosopher]

Okay, looks like I'm in the minority here, but you guys can't kick me out ... ! ;)

Here's my post-Beer Wars recap, should you choose to read it.

Feel free to tell me where I'm wrong.

[Chipper Dave]

The film clip showing the Alstrom brothers panning Moonshot should not have been shown during the live panel. Bad beer or not, Anat should not have put Rhonda up to that humiliation live and then expecting her to react to it. Moonshot segments should not have been featured as that is not a craft beer but more of an alco-pop.

What was up with Anat pre-movie? It was like she was there to accept an academy award and thanking all of her friends. Save that for if the movie ever wins an award please. Very awkward start. And casting herself as a cartoon character early in the movie? Please....

Was an ok movie but for $15 and a $1 online purchase surcharge they should have given everyone a free coupon for a beer. Simply not worth the price - better to have waited for DVD and just rented it.

There were only 10 people in the entire theater in my town (Greeley) who showed up.

I'm giving this movie a Thumb Sideways. Parts good, parts bad and other parts just ugly.

Sam Calagione stole the show. He was the best part of the whole thing. Wish they would have done more brewers like him. Greg Koch, Kim Jordon and other brewer segments were good.

Thought Charlie Papazian could have been featured more in the movie but he's more of a homebrewer. Charlie should have been the moderator and not Ben Stein.

My full review is on my blog here.

[olllllo]

Am I the only one that wishes that TLC, PBS or Discovery would have picked this up as a better edited 1/2 hour at a crack series? I think that may have eliminated the focus issues you identified Shawn.